Follow Will Be Wild wherever you get your podcasts, or you can listen early on Amazon Music or early and ad-free by subscribing to Wondery Plus in Apple Podcasts or the Wondery app. I went to Harvard and chose to have a baby with down syndrome, moved to Provo, Utah, capital of Mormonism to become a lesbian. The gates are open, whatever happens and thats the fun of it is you never know what adventure life is going to bring you when you say, I will live on this thread of truth that I feel is myself. Its like youre pulling this thread towards you. We wanted everyone to understand and embrace our relationshipand we feared that maybe many wouldnt.So we called Martha Beck for some wisdom. So I hope, thats always my aspiration for how I show up with Rows parents, but theyre so great, theyre just so great. And sometimes she does feel like I need some more time. We do not do things. Its palpable, we can feel it. 2. Sunday morning is dont get out of bed. And so theres the resentment. I dont have the logistical competency, but go, go ask questions. Period. Salty, klutzy and Aussie, Ro co-hosts the Bewildered podcast with her wife, Martha Beck. Ooh. So we knew each other and because we knew each other so well, we both knew that we both loved Rowan and theres something called compersion, Ive heard about this. Rowan Mangan:
. Okay. So its two different things, correct? Theres a complicated backstory to it. And both of them are like hard to fight with that. And we actually talked about this before we went on and we were like, oh, what do we do? Like she already knew, obviously, but how did she handle it? Theres the needing to get away. With reference to codependency. Because I think we forget how many things are optional but that feel compulsory. Rowan Mangan: The official We Own This City podcast is produced by HBO and Pineapple Street Studios.,Will Be Wild is a new 8-part series about the forces that led to the January 6th insurrection and what comes next. Row started coming to our residents. And we have what we call morning communion, which is at least an hour long of just being together and the babys zipping around and were just connecting. You probably know more about it than we do Glennon because we havent read any books. We have this silence thing. African safari change your life adventure. One can never tell one, when confronted with a question like that, unprepared. Its interesting because, you, at a certain point in your life were a caregiver for someone with paralysis, yeah? The Chalene Show | Diet, Fitness & Life Balance. So it was like a now are never kind of situation. Rowan Mangan is a writer, podcaster and mom to a vivacious toddler. You know that thing about like youre coming out as gay to your parents and then they have to think about you having sex. And then theres this thing of, Oh my God, this cannot work. And I was like, sure. But what Martha didnt know is that I was also working with her because I have a superpower about being the ultimate teachers pet. Theres two men and a woman and she gets to make all the rules and tells people what And thats what, I get it. 3. Dr. Martha Beck is a New York Times bestselling author, life coach, and speaker. 1. We rehearsed it. So she raised up on her hind legs as we walk into the room and hear this conversation and she goes, Well, I love Rowan and I love Marty. We said, What happened? And you said, I cant explain it with language. You were one of the first people that we called in search of health and advice because we didnt know how to kind of approach our love in the public eye and like you Glennon and at the time, and I was learning about deep integrity and speaking the truth and never lying early in my sobriety days, you just gave us the best piece of advice, which is just all you need to do is love each other. Id move out of the bedroom, Rowan moved in with Karen and Id get the guest room, no problem. Martha Beck: The hilarious moment Martha, Karen, and Rowan told their friends they were now a throuple. Writer. Yeah. Dr. Martha Beck is a New York Times bestselling author, life coach, and speaker. Martha is the author of The Way of Integrity- Finding Our Way Back To Our True Selves, a harvard trained sociologist and an absolite icon. And Im doing these things for physical therapy that are called kettlebell exercises. Bewildered is produced by Scott Forster with support from the brilliant team at MBI. In this chapter, I discuss case-studies that have used animal-cognition principles in conservation. And wow, Im just becoming so much more aware and yet not able to navigate or struggling to navigate. Its kind of beautiful. How Martha felt - after years of marriage to. Rowan Mangan: The hilarious moment Martha, Karen, and Rowan told their friends they were now a throuple. The dogs know about that like 20 minute time. Glennon and Abby interview their favorite person and co-host: Amanda Doyle! Rowan Mangan: A little television-Martha Beck: A little. Lets just go out there and bewilder the world. So she looked like I was interrogating her and cast her eyes about wildly about the room, like Id deviously talked her into a corner and now she didnt know how to get out. Subscribe to Wild Inventures newsletter. So this is what she said. And that is the truth. For an addict its when you realize that all the control efforts youre trying to use, I mean, sorry for a codependent, its learning that you cant control other people, no matter how hard you try. She holds three Harvard degrees in social science, and Oprah Winfrey has called her one of the smartest women I know. Her newest book, The Way of Integrity: Finding the Path to Your True Self, was an instant New York Times Best Seller. Wow. In our culture it's seen as laudable for many of us to exhibit codependent behaviors. What I do, is not advisable, and that is I go to passive aggressive, I get sick, so that I literally physically cant, and then Im trying even though Im sick to do something. Like what are some things that have been hurtful to you? And here comes Bev. And you always say, That taught me to be a good helper, and you are crazy good at helping. Martha Beck: 2. This website uses the following additional cookies: (Facebook Pixel, Google Ads Tracking & HotJar Tracking). But she can fly with a kettlebell too. She holds three Harvard degrees in social science, and Oprah Winfrey has called her one of the smartest women I know. Her newest book, The Way of Integrity: Finding the Path to Your True Self, was an instant New York Times Best Seller. Martha and Ro define codependency as over-caretaking. So we read our little passage and we started talking about it and I was trying to include my friend and be like, So do you find that in your codependency? And my friend was a little bit offended and she said-. So the first thing that happens in the morning, well Karen gets up with the baby because she gets up at like, I dont know, two or something. So either one, maybe one could be the subtitle, but. Time I learned a little something about this adopted country of mine. 2. And I said, have you asked any of my other siblings about the actual acts of sex? And she said, No. And I said, Do you want to start now? So it was my beautiful way of not having to answer that question specifically. And I was like, No, we have to have a group thread and youve got to call me sometimes and youve got to tell me that your day is going fine because I was really scared that they were the unit and I was the third wheel coming in. And that was really scary to me because it didnt feel solid. So its an over care taking. Not at the time we got together, but a long time ago I had three kids. And this is another episode of Bewildered, the podcast for people trying to figure it out. Which God is just a really good helper? Eavesdrop on life as it's lived. It can feel like exhaustion. Hi, my name is Bev. Yes. Rowan Mangan: How did your mom, what was her ultimate reaction? And I think we didnt necessarily mean to do this for the sake of our relationship, but thats like the downstream kind of effect. There is this entitlement built into every piece of society and depending on where you happen to live or be born or be characterized, thats going to happen to you. And I got much more codependent during the times when my older children were tiny and had to sort of pull myself out of it and learn, well, Ill never forget, speaking of the way nature does things. If that makes sense? You may not know this, but I was raised Mormon. Were such good friends. I would also say our mornings are pretty ritualistic where whoever wakes up first usually takes the dogs out, makes the coffee. 4. Someday Ill film the whole thing, but Im not going to be able to get her to do that again, because her will is stronger than all of ours. And just go, That was wonderful. Its just your way of love. So people make assumptions about what that is. Please note: This is an unedited transcript, provided as a courtesy, and reflects the actual conversation as closely as possible. She holds three Harvard degrees in social science, and Oprah Winfrey has called her one of the smartest women I know. Her newest book, The Way of Integrity: Finding the Path to Your True Self, was an instant New York Times Best Seller.TW: @TheMarthaBeckIG: @themarthabeckAbout Rowan:Rowan Mangan is a writer, podcaster and mom to a vivacious toddler. Were also on Instagram. Wandering The Path by Punch Deck | https://soundcloud.com/punch-deck, Music promoted by https://www.free-stock-music.com, Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Unported License, *required fields are marked with an asterisk. Okay. And let me tell you, Adam doesnt pretend anything. Martha Beck: Oh, thats so good. No worries. Okay. We read them all and love them. Rowan Mangan: We have a very abnormal family and we are very, very happy. I just love it. Its right. Of love. How Martha felt - after years of marriage to Karen - when Karen told her she was in love with Rowan, too. She was incredible. This means that every time you visit this website you will need to enable or disable cookies again. Rowan Mangan: My psychology. It shows you where oh, okay. A tangle of love stories, unrequited loves, and a steamy one-night stand that started it all! She just thought, oh. Rowan Mangan: So Abby, theres certain people who identify as polyamorous and thats part of their sexuality. And this kid is just the absolute, I mean, all kids are right, but we didnt have anything to do except sit in the house and avoid COVID. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices. I dont think their brains are capable at this point in being able to comprehend how they affect others. And yeah, women have been lower on the power hierarchy than men historically so it is much more identified as a female virtue. And I think that its quite a different thing for many people in the way that they want to love. Trying to figure something out? In September 2018, she was the only black woman in the room at Brave Magic, a famed writers retreat. Its what he likes. And then you slowly come down again. I was just thinking I should read those damn books. And they were both pretty amazing about the prospect of having another tiny person to look after. And thats how codependency feels. And then theres something going on. TW: @TheMarthaBeck She has become enmeshed in her own metaphorical web about a metaphorical web. Weve never had a fight where all three of us have been fighting. If anybody solves all the problems humans created, it will be humans. They would sing songs in Russian. Martha identifies as a codependent: someone who helps others even when helping is to her own detriment. And I wrote out a nice little guide to submitting your questions. I think its just like that thing where I dont I think its just the way that humans sort of come apart and come together clump and everything is always unique. And apparently they invented these to make people feel worse, which is, I dont know, sorry for all our Russian friends out there. And I think its shifting now in a way that is deeply spiritual as a homecoming to the soul. And if youre in nature, nature pulls you toward your nature and you start to come out of culture and then only love makes sense, period. Thank you. Rowan Mangan: I just love talking to you. Martha Beck: Wed heard that term, but we didnt really hadnt thought about it. Because, look, you got a baby, you got me, there are dogs involved. Thats the middle of the night. Whatever. 2, Kal Penn | Getting Warmer with Kal Penn, Episode 403: Everything about this is wrong, The Fox News Defamation Lawsuit: Money, Ideology, Truth, LiesIts All Right There, How To Tell Engaging Stories With Your Social Media Content. Rowan Mangan: And you said Martha, because didnt you say this about Karen too. Not like the guest room, whatever, but they werent going to break up. We are all doing hard things every day we love and lose; we forge and end friendships; battle addiction, illness, and loneliness; care for children and parents; struggle in our jobs, our marriages, our divorces; we try to set and hold boundaries and we fight for equality, purpose, joy, and peace right in the midst of all the hard. Happenings? Martha Beck: But Trinity time is coming. Its someone sitting there going, Oh no, you do that actually, Row. Or, No, that is exactly what you said 10 minutes ago, Martha, you did say that.. Anyway, they give you clues that youre not doing it right. Let's Go! Now, theyre ready to help others become better, smarter, happier cooks. And its so nice that Bev asked about that because my whole brain is all sort of turned that direction as I read through this beautiful, wonderful book. Martha Beck is silly and insightful, and listening to her and Rowan Mangan giggle while talking about how to get back to our true nature is delightful. TW: @rowanmangan Youre a fly. She also, when things are awkward, just runs away. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices, Normal Gossip delivers juicy, strange, funny, and utterly banal gossip about people youll never know and never meet. So this, oh, I have to start over. Copyright 2023 Apple Inc. All rights reserved. The hilarious moment Martha, Karen, and Rowan told their friends they were now a throuple.4. I try to live in a way that feeds my heart and soul, even when that goes against the norms of our culture. You havent talked about this a ton publicly. Bucephalus, the god of codependency. So the metaphor I always use with people, once I figured it out for myself, intellectually, if not emotionally, is that if you ask a spider what it loves and whom it loves, it might tell you, I love flies. Because spiders love flies, the way they crunch, the way they taste, all about flies is wonderful for a spider. Its time for another BeWild Files episode of Bewildered, where Martha and Rowan answer questions that YOU, the listeners, are trying to figure out! I had this bizarre reaction where I felt like I had been hit by a train full of joy, just wham, so much happiness. 2. Do you think that with people who do feel entitled to that quality of care taking or whatever, do you think you can like restructure a relationship with them thats not based on that? Like, so whenever anybody has a non-binary kid, we get the call first and theyre like, can you queer auntie them? Im sorry. No, no, no, no, no, no. Shes just wonderful. Yes, its the one polyword I know. She did make some pretty extreme sounds after that. And I dont know if we wouldve-. Rowan Mangan: Cause really this is just all about authenticity. A huge lesson for couples based on the revolutionary ways they deal with conflict, jealousy, and daily rituals to stay close. Yeah. Finding the Path to Your True Self was an instant New York Times bestseller, obviously. Rowan Mangan: I didnt know. But bisexuality had just It was so sort of obvious to me that it had barely been worth stating. Like I was very lucky and that I grew up in a very progressive sort of family and city. Yeah. I think thats one of the optional things. Like going out to that thing or being among humans or something gross like that. Like there was no option to not sit on the couch together. Yeah, Im not sure what you have to buff, but well talk about that in another episode. Theres some ego work. The Chalene Show is life coaching, personal development, nutrition, exercise, Earshot is going seasonal, welcome to our first season Promise Me. But on her way, we kept getting these updates from Rowan Mangan. Remarkable lessons for couples based on the ways they deal with conflict, jealousy, and daily rituals to stay close.Martha and Rowan entrusting their story to us feels deeply personal to me. I wish I could play along.. Or if theyre in that place, is it just probably better to move on? I know, its gross. I never told anyone. Like, oh, I guess its fine. She just doesnt care. And now they are 35, 34, 36. We are using cookies to give you the best experience on our website. So to say this, I just, we need to set up a few things around age. Thank you, Bev. And she said, I just dont know how I feel about the fact that you are both just assuming that Im codependent. And thats when Marty and I looked at each other, Thats a compliment were paying you, thinking youre codependent. And thats when we realized that the culture is inside us. So thank you very much in advance. Not the internet, the spider web. And Im like, What happened out there? And she told me Do you mind that Im telling this? Its a way of love. Its amaze balls. So Im curious about, this is obviously a psychological phenomenon, but theres also culture at play in encouraging that kind of behavior. Join us for a heavy dose of research with a dash of comedy thrown in for flavor. As she tells Emine Saner, who better to write self-help books? How Martha felt - after years of marriage to Karen - when Karen told her she was in love with Rowan, too. And Ive felt what thats like, when I think I know how to do something and someone comes to help and Im just like, I need the help, but youre doing it wrong. You have to let the other bears do it the way the bears do it. My great grandfather had three wives. Things are going to change. And that becomes, do you have one of those strappy things, right. I have literally been called the antichrist in public and I always I responded, I thought that he would be taller. What is Polyamory - and how Martha, Rowan, and Karen make their relationship work. This time the question comes from Ohio listener Bev, who hopes to learn more about codependencywhat it means and how it applies to her life as a mother and caregiver. Good. We are obsessed with fighting because we just, I dont know. Full of blue cheese. Pedestals the wrong word for lesbians, isnt it? Rowan Mangan: If you've ever felt like an over-giver, this episode is for you! * Martha recalls learning Chinese with some unhappy Russians, * Extended metaphors and exploding doormats. I think Bev has pretty much figured it out via this. So with that, I think its time to say to Bev and all our wonderful people out there-. Martha Beck: And some cuddles while we watch television. Rowan Mangan: So he calls it wine time. I havent been successful at making everyone happy even though Ive spent myself trying to do it.. Rowan Mangan: And its pervasive. Its very spiritual. And I remember sort of looking at And I think I blurted out something and this was true at the time, nothings happened. The door slams after Karen and there was a long silence. Copyright Momastery & Glennon Doyle, All Rights Reserved. This website uses Google Analytics to collect anonymous information such as the number of visitors to the site, and the most popular pages. And guess who gets to do the things that she doesnt want to do and doesnt have to do, this guy. I think all our bewilderment really just comes down to mixed metaphors. It basically means putting such a high level of attention on someone elses needs and well-being that you actually forget about yourself and what you need. I think so. Martha Beck: Rowan Mangan: So we got to try to make it our own thing. Or, look, this is not good behavior. Martha Beck: Good Lord, I heard so many stories, not just in Mormonism, of couples going to a family therapist and saying, Hes fine, but shes exhausted. Martha Beck: On the floor with my legs to either side. How Martha felt after years of marriage to Karen when Karen told her she was in love with Rowan, too. Rowan Mangan: Its just tells us more about our relationship than anything else, I feel like our conflicts. So you project what they want and need. Martha Beck: Because I dont think that people think about this enough, that the coming out process is not just stressful because you are telling your parents you like another gender or the same gender. Get off the web. A nice surprise: in each episode of SmartLess, one of the hosts reveals his mystery guest to the other two. And she got to be queen for a day and get her a new washer-dryer. 4. Rowan Mangan: Martha Beck - the bestselling author and Harvard-trained sociologist known as "Oprah Winfrey's life coach" - is talking about responses to the pandemic. Only both the same gender, so okay were content, we can handle that.. And thats a topic for another podcast. It could go really bad, right? Well, and they feel the undeniability of it, thats what happened with us. Ro offers us the concept of a Wild INventurean adventure we dream up from within, something thrilling and bold that is also uniquely our own. And if you love a cultural image of paper doll that I put out to fit the culture, you dont love me because you dont know me. I want to first thank you so much for this podcast.
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